El-Hazard Online
General => El-Hazard Online => Topic started by: Captain Southbird (EHOL Creator) on August 04, 2003, 11:25:17 pm
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Kiddo Cabbusses: Hold on a sex. ... *sec
Well, out of nowhere, I get an email from our good buddy Mr. What. Seems he has some more doujinshi's to share with us. Note that Mr. What does NOT own these, he is only sharing what he already found public. But it's pretty nifty anyway!
Now, to prevent what happened in the last topic...
* Contrary to popular belief, I did not create these. ;p(Nor did MrWhat for that matter.) Do not tell attack either of us for bringing a little Nanami-on-Alielle imagery into the world when we didn't do it.
* It's HENTAI. It's icky, sticky, gooey, naked fun ... not for the whole family. Remember that by clicking and of the images below you're setting yourself up to take on any and all resulting risks, brain melts, or bodily responses you need not tell me about.
On the plus side, there's absolutely no gender-benders in any of these! Maybe gender-orientation switches at random, but at least what's expected to be under the hood is indeed there.
In case you viewed this too fast, there are little reminders at the bottom of each post here. I had to break this up cause it was just too big. :P (Eventually I'll make these into site pages.)
Please wait for three more posts...
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Plus Y 18
Front Cover (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_000.JPG;type=jpeg)
Plus-Y 18 intro page (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_001.JPG;type=jpeg)
Index (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_002.JPG;type=jpeg)
Tickle Torture Gone Wild
Pre-viewing warning for WASHUCHAN: This is Jinnai and TV Ifurita again.
Jinnai gives her the standard tickle torture... and then some. (Many fuzzies at once!) And then apparently trips a switch or something. Zany -- but regular -- sex romping. And it appears Jinnai is slaughtered at the end.
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Random Nanami pic (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_011.JPG;type=jpeg)
Random Rune pic (the body suit failed to contain!) (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_012.JPG;type=jpeg)
"Special Friend" to the Extreme
Nanami and Alielle almost hinted at a special sort of togetherness in the Wanderers. Well, here they go all out about that one. And then Makoto walks in. Happy threesome action ensues.
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Extra Baggage
Nanami shows the ACTUAL reason why the Bugrom are on her side. Nice twist on the end with Diva too... concidering that was only the joke in Wanderers. ;p
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Random Fujisawa + Miz pic (technically not that far out of reality) (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_032.JPG;type=jpeg)
Hello. Why are you naked?
What makes me laugh about this one is it starts with a fully nude Shayla flaunting herself to Makoto who's giving weird looks that say something like "Oh... wait, there's something I'm supposed to do, but I don't remember what that is." with sincere worry on his face. I'm sure that's not the actual text, but for those of us who don't understand Japanese, it's a good laugh. ;) Then Rune walks in and stuff happens.
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Random Afura (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_049.JPG;type=jpeg)
Random Fatora/Rune pic (incest ahoy) (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_050.JPG;type=jpeg)
Alielle's Fantasy
It starts off a la OAV Episode 3... then it plays the card as if this were the hentai version. More Nanami/Alielle action.
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Makoto / Rune short (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_059.JPG;type=jpeg)
Random non-hentai TV Ifurita ... with URL (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_060.JPG;type=jpeg)
If the Keystaff Doesn't Work...
Saucer Pre-viewing Warning: It's OAV Ifurita.
Sometimes it takes a little more to wind up a demon god.
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Random Makoto / Rune image (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_071.JPG;type=jpeg)
And now for credits:
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Please wait for two more posts...
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Plus Y 20
Cover (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_20/plus-y20_00.jpg;type=jpeg)
Intro (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_20/plus-y20_01.jpg;type=jpeg)
Index (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_20/plus-y20_02.jpg;type=jpeg)
Random Alielle/Fatora short (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_20/plus-y20_03.jpg;type=jpeg)
Title Page? (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_20/plus-y20_04.jpg;type=jpeg)
Makoto and Nanami hit it Off
Hey, it's what some fans want, I guess. And nothing short of what you'd expect from a doujinshi. Nothing much more either, though.
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Who'd-a Thought?
Typical scenario starts. Makoto. Shayla. Clothes off. But then, OAV Rune walks in, says something, and Makoto finds Nanami and Fatora doing each other elsewheres. (Page 13 = Naked Makoto going "Hey, Rune, how's it goin'!?" XD)
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Well, I don't do THAT, but I do do THAT!
This starts off right where Jinnai sees Fujisawa vanish into the mountain in OAV2. But what that has to do with anything, I dunno. For then all of the sudden Kalia decides then and there she needs some lovin'. Jinnai apparently doesn't go long enough for Kalia's full amusement, though. So she utilizes her staff. Ha, who says you "don't need it anymore"? ;p
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Random shot of Alielle and Fatora getting some of what they want (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_20/plus-y20_20.jpg;type=jpeg)
... Now to take the Rest
Something about black panties. And then a Fatora/Alielle/Nanami situation comes forth. Yada Yada Yada, lesbian stuffs.
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Random shot of Shayla exposed (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_20/plus-y20_29.jpg;type=jpeg)
Random shot of Nanami exposing to Makoto (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_20/plus-y20_30.jpg;type=jpeg)
Be a Pal and Share a Makoto with Me
Mm. Well, I suppose this is placed at the end of OAV2, after Miz and Fujisawa's wedding. We know that Shayla attempts to make a move here and falters. In this version, however, it appears Nanami makes a preemptive strike and shoves Makoto out into a room to have her way. Shayla bursts in and her protests are ignored. It appears that Shayla is learning from Nanami after a while, and then they kinda work together and stuff. Fun for the whole family.
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You Manufacture them Just to Treat Them Like This ...
And now we know why the world gets destroyed. It appears Ifuritas and Kalias are manufactured strictly as pleasuring devices. And when they've had enough of this derogatory position, they blow us all up. Point made. :[
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Credits
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Please wait for one more post...
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Ick Factor
Pre-viewing Warning for Saucer ... and anyone else: OAV Ifurita ... with Masochism
A stand-alone doujinshi fraction. I suppose this was part of a greater book somewhere. I remember seeing part of this one on eBay once. The long and short of it is Ifurita gets to Makoto and demands masochistic action. Ends on a pleasant note.
9817 (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/ickfactor/9817.jpg;type=jpeg)
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O_O'
Good God, the Japanese are weird. Are there any Doujinshi in existance that isn't composed of hentai perversion?
Oh well, at least the artists managed to accurately capture in print the awesome majesty that is Jinnai Jr!
Bwah hah hahahahahahahaha!!!
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O_O'
Good God, the Japanese are weird. Are there any Doujinshi in existance that isn't composed of hentai perversion?
What I consider a horrible tragedy is this: why is it that every story in which Jinnai gets some tail ends in some HORRIBLE, HORRIBLE CATASTROPHE, usually to his all-important manhood?! >:(
That's one perk of giving Makoto a try, you know... the little pansy'd be too much a weenie to destroy him in the afterglow. >D
... Though if that S&M thing is any tipoff.... :o
Oh well, at least the artists managed to accurately capture in print the awesome majesty that is Jinnai Jr!
And thank YOU, Jinnai-sama, for giving me the laugh I truly needed tonight! XD Er, and I do mean that in the most respectful way possible. Honest! ;D
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The Alielle/Nanami/Makoto one is quite well drawn. Will comment on others later...
... when I'm in "the mood". ; )
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O_O'
Good God, the Japanese are weird. Are there any Doujinshi in existance that isn't composed of hentai perversion?
*Snerk* As I understand it the number of non-Hentai doujinshi is ridiculously outnumbered by the number of Hentai doujinshi in Japan. Doujinshi is just another way for fans to explore things that would never happen in the original source material. And, apparently, the thing that these fans want to see most is "gittin' it awn", and plenty of it. ;D
I HAVE seen the occasional non-Hentai doujinshi. In fact, I own a very nice El-Hazard one that I bought off of e-bay about a month ago. One of these days, I'll scan it and donate it to this site.
Probably someday soon. We could use a little innocent humor to scrub our brains of all this hentai. :P
Oh well, at least the artists managed to accurately capture in print the awesome majesty that is Jinnai Jr!
Bwah hah hahahahahahahaha!!!
Everyone, an awed hush for Jinnai Jr!
*Awed hush*
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I've heard the preposition of "little [Name]" before, but never heard "Junior" as the wrap-describer.
Oh. And I realize my avatar under these circumstances would easily be reinterpretated. IT'S A MICROPHONE.
And here's some entertainment from my little MegaHAL -> El-Hazard generator...
(http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/temp/rob/h/hkillkalia.jpg)
How she really killed Kalia; information overload
(http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/temp/rob/h/hVWOOSH.jpg)
"I know what kind of ancient library!" *VWOOSH* go the clothes...
(http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/temp/rob/h/hherpalm.jpg)
This has happened a few times already.
(http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/temp/rob/h/hclothing.jpg)
The doujinshi has already begun.
(http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/comic/images11/cg_shaylaknowsherfacts2.jpg)
Criticize the performance!
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I'd like to state for the record that I kept the Makoto-whips-Ifurita story strictly for its El-Hazard content. Damsel In Distress fan art is one thing, but women crying in sadistic pain and sexual humiliation makes me say "Ick!" If that's your thing, so be it-- I'm just saying that it's not my thing.
BTW, I don't know that third doujinshi's title. 'Ick Factor' was just what I called it.
I'd also like to publicly state that I try not to spend a lot of time and effort on this sort of thing in general. I've only kept scans for EH, Oh My Goddess! and two or three other random series, and just a few other random original? H manga scans that were surprisingly sweet and romantic.
Having said that... the Alielle x Nanami + Makoto story is cute, isn't it? That's probably my favorite bit. It looks as if Nanami finally caved in and consented to Alielle-- but she still has those "EEP!!" looks on her face, as if to say, "What the heck have I gotten myself into!?"
If I find anything else, I'll pass it on. I wasn't expecting Rob to share these so quickly, but I'm glad that he did. I've seen several El-Hazard doujinshi come and go on eBay, so there's still quite a bit to find.
And I'll try to translate some of this stuff within the next couple of years, if no one better qualified comes along. I'm still drilling JLPT level 3 vocabulary, so a lot of this is still beyond me-- to say nothing of the challenge of bad doujinshi handwriting, or the, uh, unique vocabulary of H doujinshi.
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BTW, I don't know that third doujinshi's title. 'Ick Factor' was just what I called it.
Well, I'm sure we all sort of guessed at least one of us called it that. I mean, no self-respecting masochist doujinshi creator would dare suggest what he was creating was actually disturbing. ;)
I'd also like to publicly state that I try not to spend a lot of time and effort on this sort of thing in general.
It's okay. I mean, Kiddo practically is the definition of that concept, but we still take him for who he is. But generally I don't think any of us actually live a life of hentai collecting. Just having submitted a few certainly won't automatically have you typedef'ed as Master of Perversion. I think all of us have a slightly perverted side anyway.
I've only kept scans for EH, Oh My Goddess! and two or three other random series, and just a few other random original? H manga scans that were surprisingly sweet and romantic.
Having said that... the Alielle x Nanami + Makoto story is cute, isn't it? That's probably my favorite bit. It looks as if Nanami finally caved in and consented to Alielle-- but she still has those "EEP!!" looks on her face, as if to say, "What the heck have I gotten myself into!?"
It is hard for hentai to even approach romantic. Let's face it, doujinshi artists are typically going for a goal. I personally on the other hand prefer sex to be part of a larger plot, something that two people finally reach after pining for each other at a soulful level for a conciderably long amount of time. Something emotional rather than purely physical. Of course I'm just getting off topic. ;) These drawings are satisfying for the curiosity, however, especially when they're well drawn in a very similar or dead-on style.
Indirectly on that note, an Alielle / Nanami relationship possibility almost seems to be hinted during the course of Wanderers. I was also always a tad disturbed by the fact that Nanami was never very resilient to Alielle clinging to her arm and other such things in the OAV. Somehow it almost suggests that at some level, Nanami is, perhaps, an "either way" girl. Of course, maybe I'm just looking into it too deeply.
If I find anything else, I'll pass it on. I wasn't expecting Rob to share these so quickly, but I'm glad that he did.
I wanted to quickly get the bad taste of shemales out of everyone's mouth including my own. ;)
And I'll try to translate some of this stuff within the next couple of years, if no one better qualified comes along. I'm still drilling JLPT level 3 vocabulary, so a lot of this is still beyond me-- to say nothing of the challenge of bad doujinshi handwriting, or the, uh, unique vocabulary of H doujinshi.
Fortunately, unlike dramas or the Japanese vocals on music tracks, hentai doujinshi doesn't absolutely require any major explanation. It's either:
1) "I'm naked!" "Hey, me too!"
2) "I'll get naked." "I'll go along with that."
... at least in what we have so far.
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Ever start on something, because it seemed like agood idea at the time? Then realize "Gawd, I've wasted a whole evening on this?" -_-; Well, I got through the first set, so I might as well comment.
Plus Y 18
Plus-Y 18 intro page (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/register/eholmemberfile.cgi?getfile=doujinshi/plusy_18/plus-y_18_001.JPG;type=jpeg)
Notice the shoujo style artwork? ^^;
Tickle Torture Gone Wild
Pre-viewing warning for WASHUCHAN: This is Jinnai and TV Ifurita again.
Jinnai gives her the standard tickle torture... and then some. (Many fuzzies at once!) And then apparently trips a switch or something. Zany -- but regular -- sex romping. And it appears Jinnai is slaughtered at the end.
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Rather well drawn. ^^;
"Special Friend" to the Extreme
Nanami and Alielle almost hinted at a special sort of togetherness in the Wanderers. Well, here they go all out about that one. And then Makoto walks in. Happy threesome action ensues.
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Speedlines! Reminds me of Ebichu.
Extra Baggage
Nanami shows the ACTUAL reason why the Bugrom are on her side. Nice twist on the end with Diva too... concidering that was only the joke in Wanderers. ;p
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WTH is with the chara design! Looks a bit like Takahashi-sensei (like, Nanami kinda looks like Akane ^^; )
Hello. Why are you naked?
What makes me laugh about this one is it starts with a fully nude Shayla flaunting herself to Makoto who's giving weird looks that say something like "Oh... wait, there's something I'm supposed to do, but I don't remember what that is." with sincere worry on his face. I'm sure that's not the actual text, but for those of us who don't understand Japanese, it's a good laugh. ;) Then Rune walks in and stuff happens.
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Women are always plotting and scheming on stuff like that. "Oh Miss Shayla, please teach Makoto how to fuck, for me!"
Alielle's Fantasy
It starts off a la OAV Episode 3... then it plays the card as if this were the hentai version. More Nanami/Alielle action.
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This one was the worst. The Gag Strip-style artwork made it wrong. *COUGH*ebichu*COUGH*
If the Keystaff Doesn't Work...
Saucer Pre-viewing Warning: It's OAV Ifurita.
-_-; Thanks for the warning. *AVOID*
It is hard for hentai to even approach romantic. Let's face it, doujinshi artists are typically going for a goal. I personally on the other hand prefer sex to be part of a larger plot, something that two people finally reach after pining for each other at a soulful level for a conciderably long amount of time. Something emotional rather than purely physical. Of course I'm just getting off topic. ;) These drawings are satisfying for the curiosity, however, especially when they're well drawn in a very similar or dead-on style.
See, for something like that, you'll want to check out Masquerade or Spaceship Agga Ruter. Both of which, incidentally, are created by Masaki Kajishima (co-creator of Tenchi Muyo) and produced by AIC.
For what it's worth, the best hentai OVAs IMHO, and the only ones I'd recommend to non-hentai fans.
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Rather well drawn. ^^;
thanks for the explicit warning, Rob :)
btw, do you keep statistics of the site visitor + people registering as members?
I'm just curious, say in about 1 week after these "artwork" are posted, would you care telling us if there;s a sudden change in the trend/slope?
ps: sorry, I guess I broke the new rule in pctm
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btw, do you keep statistics of the site visitor + people registering as members?
I'm just curious, say in about 1 week after these "artwork" are posted, would you care telling us if there;s a sudden change in the trend/slope?
No more than the numbers on the main site. If there's a curiosity, just watch them I suppose.
ps: sorry, I guess I broke the new rule in pctm
Well, that's still in debate, don't worry about it yet. It's probably designed to be more of a suggestion than a rule.
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:o
I probably shouldn't have looked at them, being one of the youngest members of EHOL.
*tries to remember where she found the 'Lunarian' pic she has stored on her PC* *grins devilishly.*
I'd look at them all...but...
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Yay, I can post again.
Speaking of doujinshi, I did come across some El Hazard hentai a long time ago which half was in color. Though I didn't recognize any of the characters.
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I'd look at them all...but...
Finish what you start, girl! *decked*
Speaking of doujinshi, I did come across some El Hazard hentai a long time ago which half was in color. Though I didn't recognize any of the characters.
Well, I have a few images of color *goes through the directory* ... 6x Afura, 6x Alielle, 6x Diva, 4x Fatora, 3x Ifurita OAV, 7x Ifurita TV, 4x Kalia, 1x Kariya, 4x Miz, 7x Nanami, 1x Quawool, 4x Rune OAV, 5x Rune TV, 11x Shayla (O_O), and one that appears to be from a random doujinshi. (Note that any of these may contain more than just the stated character; that stated character is just the "star".)
These are just ones I collected off one site Neil found by accident... and have seen reused at just about any other hentai site. It appears these are the only color El-Hazard "color hentai single frames" in existence. OAV Ifurita and Quawool were both grouped together as "Miz", showing how much actual knowledge the person had about the series they were setting up. :P
I'll probably pile them all along with these doujinshi's into a specially deticated section. But just to cut down on unwanted registrants that register for this just like I had with the MP3's... it'll be a section hidden until after successful log in. :P
Not that it'll matter much if/once word gets out... mm.
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Well, I'm sure we all sort of guessed at least one of us called it that.
Just wanted to make it perfectly clear. Many anime and manga do have rather wacky English names.
But generally I don't think any of us actually live a life of hentai collecting. Just having submitted a few certainly won't automatically have you typedef'ed as Master of Perversion. I think all of us have a slightly perverted side anyway.
Thanks. Again, just wanted to make it clear. It was a bit much for me to joke about that Damsel In Distress fan art, and then to donate that last page of "Ick Factor," I think.
And I wanted to add a disclaimer to the topic for any newer members. I guess the regulars know me pretty well by now, but "Ick Factor" could make one heck of a first impression.
It is hard for hentai to even approach romantic. Let's face it, doujinshi artists are typically going for a goal. I personally on the other hand prefer sex to be part of a larger plot, something that two people finally reach after pining for each other at a soulful level for a conciderably long amount of time. Something emotional rather than purely physical. Of course I'm just getting off topic. ;)
One of those H mangas that I DLed, certainly an exception to the rule, is actually one of the most sweet and romantic anthology works that I've ever seen. Man, I sound like a girl.
These drawings are satisfying for the curiosity, however, especially when they're well drawn in a very similar or dead-on style.
I like the ones that are well-done in other styles, too. Just to see other people's reinterpretation of the character designs.
Indirectly on that note, an Alielle / Nanami relationship possibility almost seems to be hinted during the course of Wanderers. I was also always a tad disturbed by the fact that Nanami was never very resilient to Alielle clinging to her arm and other such things in the OAV. Somehow it almost suggests that at some level, Nanami is, perhaps, an "either way" girl. Of course, maybe I'm just looking into it too deeply.
You, and at least half of the general public. When Alielle says "we're special friends" in episode 26, well, you know what we're all thinking.
From memory, Nanami seriously thought about switching teams in Dooky's SOTTC. And I couldn't resist hinting at that a couple of times in my own fan fiction, in my usual jokey way.
I ought to admit that I'm a typical heterosexual male hypocrite, as far as that sort of thing goes. Xel's Makoto-Jinnai predilection makes for some great humor, but personally, it gives me the screaming heebie-jeebies.
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I ought to admit that I'm a typical heterosexual male hypocrite, as far as that sort of thing goes. Xel's Makoto-Jinnai predilection makes for some great humor, but personally, it gives me the screaming heebie-jeebies.
Yes yes... so many of us are. :P I guess there's something where you care about your own sexuality that you don't want deviation, but when the "other side" is mixing things it won't effect you any so you don't care or even enjoy the concept. Case in point, what does Xel (or any of the other few on-board straight females) think about lesbians? (I only say straight because we're talking about straight hypocrites at the moment ;))
Actually, you'd think I'd be totally sour on lesbianism because of the girl who left me over a year ago on notice that she'd "never be satisifed" if she didn't find another woman who'd do ... some stuff with her. And indeed the whole experience used to often give me immediate anger/rage bouts if any lesbian or bisexual female happened to bounce about within my "vicinity" (i.e. post in the same forum as me, be in the same chat room as me, etc.) I'd immediately want to murder them in the worst way or something. I'm not kidding either. Not the proudest time of my life.
Ultimately, though, as any healthy mind should, it all got smoothened out, fixed and/or comprimised based on various parameters. I'm still nervous as hell of ever getting into a relationship again because of either thinking I'm inadequate or getting that speech again (because I kind of get both feelings thinking I'm not "satisfying"), but yet I actually feel some sympathy for anyone who's sexual orientation deviates from the "standard". It's gotta be the hardest thing in the world to tolerate and work with.
...
ANYWAY. Having said that, I would feel a passion for Nanami if she came to realize such a thing about herself. The end. :P
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Xel's Makoto-Jinnai predilection makes for some great humor, but personally, it gives me the screaming heebie-jeebies.
I definately concur. Both my heebies and jeebies scream their asses off whenever I read one of Xel's creepy posts.
As for girl on girl vs. guy on guy, well... here's my take. Girls are lovey dovey and crap, so I guess it's only natural for the floozies to go for each other. I mean, girls like to yap all the time and hug, right? Well then they got their perfect matches: in each other. Simple logic.
On the other hand, guys boffin guys, well... lemme just put it to you straight: That's just gay.
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On the other hand, guys boffin guys, well... lemme just put it to you straight: That's just gay.
That reminds me of the time when my friends and I were in my dorm watching Gravitation.
Our friend Matt was with us cos he was bored... we got through the first full episode and at the very end the two lead males helped themselves to a big smooch ^_^;
Matt (the only male in the room) screamed "AAAHH GAYNESS!"
Amy: "umm... didn't you NOTICE that they were flirting throughout the whole first episode?"
Matt: "no... "
The funniest thing of all, was he stayed to watch the next episode ^_^;
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I guess I can see where you're coming from on that to a degree, but... technically the most effeminate of the male homosexuals can be incredibly woman like in that respect.
...
This topic's getting dangerous. I sense a disturbance. :P
OFF, OFF THE GAYNESS. RETURN TO THE DOUJINSHIS.
Wait, that's almost like a self-conflicting statement or something...
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OFF, OFF THE GAYNESS. RETURN TO THE DOUJINSHIS.
Wait, that's almost like a self-conflicting statement or something...
It is... So lesbians are ok but no "gayness?"
That hardly seems fair...
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Actually, I meant it in the somewhat obscure referencing of being gender-neutral. Nonetheless, to reiterate, let us return to the doujinshis in this thread and not worry about the complexities of sexual orientation. :P
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Nonetheless, to reiterate, let us return to the doujinshis in this thread and not worry about the complexities of sexual orientation. :P
aww damn, I was just about to get into narcissism! ;D
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Sorry to bring up something that's supposed to have been dropped, but my name was mentioned like three times so I'll feel negligent if I don't reply. :P
Re TEH GHEI: Meh. Boy-boy, boy-girl, girl-girl... if a relationship is intriguing (like MxJ... or maybe the kernel of AliellexDiva I heard in the Jinnai's World dramas ;D), it's intriguing. Wouldn't be very good of me to go "siiiigh, yaoi... <3" and then turn around and say "LESBIANS, EWWW!", now would it? >XD
Nah, but really... at least you guys admit to it. ^^;
But right! Back to doujinshi! Generally speaking, I prefer story with my sex across the board. Unfortunately, this is most difficult to find in doujinshi especially... it being so, er... visual, I would imagine. That's pretty much why I stick to the written word for my fandom needs, on the whole, though I have been known to have a certain appreciation for some nice art, too. ;)
That one Jinnai/Iffy DJ... something bothers me about it. I think it's that he's wearing no shirt. I mean, Big Mean Aggressive Subjugator types never remove their clothes during sex in doujinshi!
I suppose it could also be that he's one of the most constantly-clothed guys around. As we have seen in this case, even in most of the hentai he's involved in has him fully suit-clad. It's like an extension of his body or something. I think suddenly seeing such a huge percentage of exposed Jinnai-flesh must have caused some sort of cataclysmic short-circuit in my brain.
Er, again, I mean that in the most respectful terms possible, sir.
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Oh, don't worry your foolish little head, Xel. I am not offended.
I do agree though, that many would swoon if they were ever to see me bare-chested. It's like when Clark Kent takes off his glasses. Many people would never realize that such a fine, toned physique lay underneathe my crisp and oh-so-stylish duds.
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Finish what you start, girl! *decked*
Alright, I'll look at them all tomorrow. But if I get caught by my parents, I'll blame you Rob. ;)
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Well, I was kidding. Technically it deserves one of those "No Admittance Under 21 -- Submit your credit card number for
my purchasing pleasure verification of age." kind of things.
But I won't/can't stop you either. :P
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Well, I was kidding. Technically it deserves one of those "No Admittance Under 21 -- Submit your credit card number for my purchasing pleasure verification of age." kind of things.
But I won't/can't stop you either. :P
Awww, but doujinshi isn't REAL pr0n! (I know, TEH LAW The Mighty Word of Parental Discretion says it is, for the most part... but really. 2D and paper and screentone aside, how often do you see some of this stuff *coughAfuraShaylacough* happening in real live porn-o'-graphy? ;D;;
Please excuse my sudden compulsion to draw young Porn O'Graphy, the plucky smut-hoarding leprechaun. I will now proceed to stab myself in the head repeatedly so none of you have to.
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Awww, but doujinshi isn't REAL pr0n! (I know, TEH LAW The Mighty Word of Parental Discretion says it is, for the most part... but really.
Yes, I know. I was just exaggerating the point. I was more into the give me your credit card number for my spending pleasure bit. ;D
2D and paper and screentone aside, how often do you see some of this stuff *coughAfuraShaylacough* happening in real live porn-o'-graphy? ;D;;
Be careful what you ask for. Because uh... that is sort of available. I mean, they don't change sexes in realtime, but ... the combination ... yeah.
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I don't show up for a whole day again, and I miss out on a discussion! Guess that's the pace things move at on the web. Well, I know we're trying to move past this. So, you can skip this post if you want but......
I'm from San Francisco (well, actually a little farther down the peninsula. but close enough for the purposes of this discussion) so I'm pretty tolerant of every manner of gender deviation (with-in legal lmits and general reason). Kinda have to be, in this area. But yes, shounen ai gives me the heebie jeebies, too. I'm sorry, but I'm a straight male. I have no desire to watch two guys make out. Does that make me a homophobe? In some people's eyes. Let 'em eat cake. I gotten alot of flack at another board where I was moderating the hentai section. There was a hentai pic post thread, and I had instituted a rule that pics had to be posted in differing thread according to content. Several members, including myself, were growing weary of stumbling across raunchy shounen ai pics in thread. So, you call me a homophobe for not wanting to look at that? Please.
On the other hand, I simply love lesbians. Does that make me a hypocrite? I'm a straight male, as I said before. What else can I say? Call me what you will. I know plenty of women who don't like lesbians, but love watching gay men. Are they hypocrites, too? I heard, and reasoned out, good explanations for why men like lesbians and why women like gays. But we can get inot that later if anyone is interested. I think this off-topic thread has already gone on far too long. ^^;
But one more thing.... about your story Rob. I'm sorry man. But, for what it's worth, she did you a favor man. I know it sounds trite, but it really is true. I got dumped for a complete and total loser by my last girlfriend. It made me feel like shit for a long time. But in the end, I realized, do I really want to be with a selfish and naive person like that. Decent chaps, such as ourselves, aren't seserving of such treatment. Ya know. *SHRUGS*
That reminds me of the time when my friends and I were in my dorm watching Gravitation.
Our friend Matt was with us cos he was bored... we got through the first full episode and at the very end the two lead males helped themselves to a big smooch ^_^;
Matt (the only male in the room) screamed "AAAHH GAYNESS!"
Amy: "umm... didn't you NOTICE that they were flirting throughout the whole first episode?"
Matt: "no... "
The funniest thing of all, was he stayed to watch the next episode ^_^;
LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLOL!!!!! As soon as I saw the first line, I was LMAO. Tell me, why are all shounen ai series about a rock band?
Reminds me of the time, I was watching a movie with a girl I liked at my house. It was Chuck and Buck. O_O;;; Little did I know..... Never been more embarrased in my entire life.
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Reminds me of the time, I was watching a movie with a girl I liked at my house. It was Chuck and Buck. O_O;;; Little did I know..... Never been more embarrased in my entire life.
Man that was a CREEPY movie. Not only is it about gay stuff, but FREAKY STALKER gay stuff.
I had watched that movie with a group of mixed company (two girls, three guys) and let me tell you, that was a bizarre experience into of itself. While the movie was playing, all the girls were going, "Awww, poor guy," and "Awww, that's so sad," while the reactions of the males in the room ranged from startled disbelief to sheer knuckle-clenching fright.
Yep, men and women truly are different.
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I'm from San Francisco (well, actually a little farther down the peninsula. but close enough for the purposes of this discussion) so I'm pretty tolerant of every manner of gender deviation (with-in legal lmits and general reason). Kinda have to be, in this area. But yes, shounen ai gives me the heebie jeebies, too. I'm sorry, but I'm a straight male. I have no desire to watch two guys make out. Does that make me a homophobe? In some people's eyes. Let 'em eat cake. I gotten alot of flack at another board where I was moderating the hentai section. There was a hentai pic post thread, and I had instituted a rule that pics had to be posted in differing thread according to content. Several members, including myself, were growing weary of stumbling across raunchy shounen ai pics in thread. So, you call me a homophobe for not wanting to look at that? Please.
On the other hand, I simply love lesbians. Does that make me a hypocrite? I'm a straight male, as I said before. What else can I say? Call me what you will. I know plenty of women who don't like lesbians, but love watching gay men. Are they hypocrites, too? I heard, and reasoned out, good explanations for why men like lesbians and why women like gays. But we can get inot that later if anyone is interested.
Well, I got nervous about the topic before, but I guess I'm getting some reinforcement. Yes, it's just a general thing I guess. A typical straight male just only cares about what happens with women, whether because of him, or because of one of their own kind, or whatever. But another guy just won't do it for us (if not cause us to reject the image) simply because I suppose we're not wired to respond that way. In fact, it might even have to do with the basic biological implementation that's supposed to make sure the species reproduce. Of course women turn us on; they're the only ones we can procreate with. Of course then we reject males because I guess nothing gets accomplished. Not to make this into a "homosexuality is not natural and therefore punishable by death" thing, I swear; I'm just trying to write the basic below-conscious level rulings of the brain... basically the rules that are supposed to guide us no matter how knowledge-insufficent we are. That is, even someone who is completely isolated from all knowledge of sex is going to figure it out sooner or later whether he/she means to or not. In fact, I'm evidence of discovering the operation myself... yes. (http://echoalpha.com/smileys/sweatdrop.gif) [To borrow from Mr. What]
So, anyway. We're probably designed with a drive to make sure we end up on the "right" side of things. Actually, this pre-programming may even explain the area where hetero/bi/homosexuality exists. A particular polarization or defunct ruleset of the subconscious, where a mismatch for your gender causes homosexuality and for some reason the rule being defunct altogether makes you go either way. Just like masochists are typically in to it because their pleasure and pain centers are cross-wired. (Which I suppose is the basis of that masochist Ifurita story; pleasure from all her pain made her work in the first place. (http://echoalpha.com/smileys/sweatdrop.gif) [To borrow from Mr. What again] Of course, this is just a theory, and you'll do what you will with it.
But one more thing.... about your story Rob. I'm sorry man. But, for what it's worth, she did you a favor man. I know it sounds trite, but it really is true. I got dumped for a complete and total loser by my last girlfriend. It made me feel like shit for a long time. But in the end, I realized, do I really want to be with a selfish and naive person like that. Decent chaps, such as ourselves, aren't seserving of such treatment. Ya know. *SHRUGS*
Yeah, well, it's all in the past now, for the most part. Except for a dream I had not too long ago which featured me going Jinnai on a mall crowd over a reenactment of the event, I've generally restabalized mentally. Although interestingly I think I came out of it with a higher confidence level, a bit more aggression, and a slight scale of perversion previously subdued. (Technically I'd say she was the first to make mild perversion out to be okay from the previous series fandom I was involved in, based on not-really-hentai hentai [US-based cartoon series])
But let's put it this way; the aggression and confidence that made me go around and flaunt this site to others and search engines is what made it good enough to get to this point today. ;) Now if only I had more time... or someone is interested in becoming a secondary site aid. I mean, not to stray into a third topic, but there's not much to it. The pages are all templated and generated via CGI... well, another time maybe.
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Well, Rob made me look through them. Then half way through I realised my dad has the 'history' button, and he could check that I was looking at them. I think I got to the Miz and Fujisawa one.
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Heheh... what a discussion to miss.
(NOTE: To anyone who wants to act like they're in a dojin, I would gladly-::shot:: )
... Anyway, sadly, I am waiting for my pr0n-collecting computer to be able to collect pr0n again, so I'll have to wait... oooh, the pain... ;-;
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You know, when I saw kiddo had posted I was really worried. :P
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Yes. Be very afraid when I post. It's more than likely 50 times as perverse as you'd ever wish something to be.
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*thinks personal thoughts* In some ways, there is only one thing more perverse than my mind...a porn channel...
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Actually, most American porn channels are boring. Just random clips of naked men and women jumping up and doen tastelessly, with no plot or even hot bodies. :/
.... DON'T ask how I know. ;P
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You've been watching porn again, haven't you? ;D
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Meh. Well, while I personally don't buy your theory, Rob (I consider personal human tastes and preferences as a little more intricate than simply being the way we're biologically programmed), I suppose I can see where you're coming from. But to keep this, er... less dangerous, just chalk it up to simply what does it for ya and what doesn't. ;D;;
One thing I've always thought was interesting is the widely-accepted love that guys have for lesbians, while a lot of other girls tend to look at me funny over my yaoi thing. ^^ An oddity, that...
Yes. Be very afraid when I post. It's more than likely 50 times as perverse as you'd ever wish something to be.
Bah! I'll bet you anything that I can give you a run for your money, little man. >D >D
Come on! Them's fightin' words! *battle stance*
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(I consider personal human tastes and preferences as a little more intricate than simply being the way we're biologically programmed
You'd be surprised what programming is in you. But I didn't say ALL preferences/tastes. And I suppose some things can be influenced based on your upbringing. But there are certain undeniable facts in every human's existence I could not think to attribute it to anything less than a standard boiler plate from which all of our brains are produced. The simplest, of course, are your heart beating and your lungs breathing. But let's take it up a notch. There's a basic instinct to survive in all of us. Generally if we're hit, we retaliate or become worried some how. If something moves quickly towards your eyes, they close in preperation and protection. It's a system of instinctual behavior that you don't even really have to learn or think about, just things that are built-in for your general survival purposes.
Similiarly, somewhere between the ages of 11-13 all humans suddenly find themselves akwardly "aware" of a particular gender and curious of their own. To what amounts/extremes is up to something else.
But remember, no matter how nice a face you put on it all, we're actually just big hulking machines driven by a series of secreted chemicals applied to various areas of a squishy mass known as a brain. But we surely are niftily complicated.
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Man that was a CREEPY movie. Not only is it about gay stuff, but FREAKY STALKER gay stuff.
Yes, not to mention that he had mental problems up the yang. That was one freaky movie, and I'm still not sure what the intent of the director was. Maybe just to fuck with you? For the rest of my life, I will wake up in the middle of the night from a mightmare, with the creepy whispered phrase "Chuck and Buck, Fuck and Suck!" in my ears. Oh, the horror.....
Well, I got nervous about the topic before, but I guess I'm getting some reinforcement. Yes, it's just a general thing I guess. A typical straight male just only cares about what happens with women, whether because of him, or because of one of their own kind, or whatever. But another guy just won't do it for us (if not cause us to reject the image) simply because I suppose we're not wired to respond that way. In fact, it might even have to do with the basic biological implementation that's supposed to make sure the species reproduce. Of course women turn us on; they're the only ones we can procreate with. Of course then we reject males because I guess nothing gets accomplished. Not to make this into a "homosexuality is not natural and therefore punishable by death" thing, I swear; I'm just trying to write the basic below-conscious level rulings of the brain... basically the rules that are supposed to guide us no matter how knowledge-insufficent we are. That is, even someone who is completely isolated from all knowledge of sex is going to figure it out sooner or later whether he/she means to or not. In fact, I'm evidence of discovering the operation myself... yes. (http://echoalpha.com/smileys/sweatdrop.gif) [To borrow from Mr. What]
So, anyway. We're probably designed with a drive to make sure we end up on the "right" side of things. Actually, this pre-programming may even explain the area where hetero/bi/homosexuality exists. A particular polarization or defunct ruleset of the subconscious, where a mismatch for your gender causes homosexuality and for some reason the rule being defunct altogether makes you go either way. Just like masochists are typically in to it because their pleasure and pain centers are cross-wired. (Which I suppose is the basis of that masochist Ifurita story; pleasure from all her pain made her work in the first place. (http://echoalpha.com/smileys/sweatdrop.gif) [To borrow from Mr. What again] Of course, this is just a theory, and you'll do what you will with it.
Wow ^^; that's a rather wordy explanation. But I concur with it pretty much 100%. I often find that the scientific explanation satisfies me, most of the time. Good job!
As for my theory why men like lesbians (even though no one asked), and since women are always asking this question, here it is. Mostly, it's competition. How often have you been talking to a woman, and as soon as she says "My boyfriend....." or "My husband....." and something inside you just shuts off? It's a strange feeling, but it happens. You see a man with a woman and you feel like you have to compete with him. Even, on the most miniscule level. You may feel this when reading a story, or watching anime or a movie. Or, even porn or hentai. Watch a porn sometime and see how quickly you get turned off looking a some guy with a dong bigger than yours, pounding away at a woman. With two women, there's no need to feel like you have to compete with another guy. (Just speculation and personal feeling. No offense Rob. ^_^; )
As for why women like gay/shounen ai, I've read a theory somewhere before. At least it explains the popularity of shounen ai amongst straight women in Japan; girls like to think that boys are interested in something else besides soccer. It's appealing to see them interested in relationships and romance. But, why two guys? Good question. Keep in mind, some women get turned on by seeing two guys for the same reason some men get turned on by seeing two women. Just like my friend, who wouldn't let me shut off Chuck & Buck, even they started making out. "I want to see what happens!" she says. Yeah, great. Thanks. -_-;
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As for my theory why men like lesbians (even though no one asked), and since women are always asking this question, here it is. Mostly, it's competition. How often have you been talking to a woman, and as soon as she says "My boyfriend....." or "My husband....." and something inside you just shuts off? It's a strange feeling, but it happens. You see a man with a woman and you feel like you have to compete with him. Even, on the most miniscule level. You may feel this when reading a story, or watching anime or a movie. Or, even porn or hentai. Watch a porn sometime and see how quickly you get turned off looking a some guy with a dong bigger than yours, pounding away at a woman. With two women, there's no need to feel like you have to compete with another guy. (Just speculation and personal feeling. No offense Rob. ^_^; )
Actually, I have to agree with all this business. But yes, normally it's all true, except that it was an immediate box-in even worse than "another guy" taking the girl, it was a girl taking the girl, which made it virtually impossible to compete. :P But that was a special case.
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Alrighty. I think this discussion was at least partly my fault, and since it's continued, I'd like to try to clarify my previously stated position. And yes, I think this is a dangerous topic for a message board, so I'll try to make this my last post on the topic. It'll help kill a Saturday evening in Gillespie IL, anyway.
With regards to Teh Ghey. My understanding is that the current scientific opinion is that "born that way" is an over-simplification, but-- people are born with genetic predispositions that may or may not be affected by their environment. Essentially, sexual orientation is not a "choice." Further, my understanding is that male homosexuality and female homosexuality are different, just as heterosexual male and female responses are different.
I believe there are also studies that indicate that women are generally more accepting of lesbians than men are of male gays. But it is also my understanding that these opinions are not as generally accepted as the other conclusions. If nothing else, these studies were joked about as being suspect because they were conducted by heterosexual men ;)
Now. What about me? Well, let me try to re-state how I feel, hopefully without providing Too Much Information.
I wish that every touch didn't have to have sexual connotations. I wish all people could be physically closer in general. People react positively to physical contact. It can be a real comfort. I think I remember reading where touch can have a direct impact on a person's health.
I remember watching a British TV show, where these two older gentlemen were walking down a road together, arm in arm, chatting about having lunch. As far as I know, both characters in the TV show were straight. I think a lot of guys would say that is Teh Ghey, but I thought it was rather nice. I don't know, maybe you see that more often in other places than in the midwest US.
Now, men kissing is where I start to have problems. I guess kissing is a borderline sexual act for me. Maybe that's my environment. Maybe that's my genetic predisposition. And that's also where the hypocrisy starts. Women kissing each other doesn't bother me, although it doesn't, uh, interest me as much as it seems to interest other straight guys. But I just don't like to see men kissing. I just... don't.
And men doing more than kissing... well, that's when my heebies and jeebies start screaming.
But when it's two women? At the risk of generalizing again-- my favorite theory is, it's not that it's two women doing things to each other as much as it's just two women. For a straight guy, it's like, double your pleasure, double your fun. And you get to look at a second female form, which is more aesthetically pleasing than some guy's big hairy butt. And for straight women, it's just the same thing in reverse.
If men were logical about things, they shouldn't "like" to see lesbianism, if for no other reason than that reduces a single straight guy's possibilities by two. But none of this is logical, is it?
Having said that... I sincerely enjoyed Xel's fan fiction, and I'll usually make an effort to read shounen-ai fan fiction that has a humorous edge to it. It's not personally enjoyable for me, in the same way it might be for a heterosexual female, or in the same way that shoujo-ai stereotypically is for a straight guy. But for me, it gives the humor an extra punch when my heebies and jeebies are screaming.
One last note... I agree, again, that explicit content in creative works is almost always more enjoyable when you have an emotional connection with the characters. Again, I think a lot of guys would say that is Teh Ghey. But a little story-line, a little dramatic conflict, and a little humor, makes the payoff so much better.
Of course, an emotional connection isn't required when you delve into the wild and wacky world of fetishes. I'm pretty sure several of you could out-weird me any day-- but besides all the other weird things I've joked about in my fan-fiction and captions and such-- you don't need an involving back-story when you're watching to see how many naked women can stuff themselves into a phone booth. (BTW, the answer is 17.)
Okay, that's more than enough of that. And here's the requisite (http://echoalpha.com/smileys/sweatdrop.gif)
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To reiterate: I have brought the ^^; into our standard collection anyways for the time being.
Lemme see... ah yes, in other news, all doujinshi and related materials are cleanly stuffed into a new site section. Includes all the color hentai single images I know to exist (and have been posted by Kiddo at least twice) and a second half to the same book that "Ick Factor" came from. (I matched it via a scan from an eBay auction I held on to; I kept these scans of the ones I don't own as a gag originally, but now they're proving useful.)
You can currently only access it via the main page menu or you can click here (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/cgi-bin/eholpage.cgi?series=NA;menu=10;content=doujinshi/doujinshi.html)
It's invisible to non-logged in / unregistered members... I'm trying to prevent another MP3 fiasco, y'know? (People registered just to download MP3's; I can see the same for hentai)
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I think environment and upbringing has a major impact on how tolerant a person is to gays. In ancient Greece and Rome for instance, sex between men were perfectly acceptable, and in some city states even preferred to straight sex. In Greece, it was the male form that was considered the summit of beauty, while the female body was the one considered unsightly.
I remember watching a British TV show, where these two older gentlemen were walking down a road together, arm in arm, chatting about having lunch.
That wouldn't have been the Doctor Who episode The Two Doctors would it? Cuz that scene wasn't as pleasant as you made it out to seem. Although those two were chatting about lunch, eventually the conversation turned to cannibalism. ^^;
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I think it's also worth noting that fantasy homosexuality and real-life homosexuality are pretty much as different as night and day. In fantasy settings, whether they be relatively innocent or hardcore pr0n, the characters generally don't have to worry about things like social ostricization or bigotry. Heck, a lot of the time it's almost as though no one even notices what gender the participants are. When observing two men or two women sitting together and chatting over lunch, other individuals in the fantasy are as likely to wonder whether they're romantically involved as they would if it was a man and a woman chatting. If a character IS homosexual, he or she is usually completely comfortable with it, and neither feels the need to hide it or to flaunt it. If someone is openly homosexual, his or her same-sex friends are also completely comfortable with it, as well. They never wonder, "Is he/she coming on to me? Does he/she find me attractive? If he/she does, should I be flattered or offended?"
In real life, of course, homosexuality is nothing like that. Discovering that oneself is homosexual is usually a pretty traumatic experience. And with good reason - a homosexual is in for a lot of strife in his or her future. Society tends to view homosexuals with distrust and dislike (and not just western societies - for all the prominence of homosexual themes in their literature, Japanese conformism ensures that homosexuals are kept firmly in "their place" as well). Finding a life partner can be difficult, because in spite of misleading statistics, homosexuals simply aren't very common.
I, even though I do enjoy joking about it and stuff, tend to disapprove of homosexuality in anime, manga, fanfiction, etc. It's not because I'm homophobic. Actually, it's pretty near the complete opposite - I disapprove of it because I feel that it trivializes and romanticizes real-life homosexuality. Every now and then, a teenaged girl (it's almost always a girl) on one or another of the mailing lists announces that she's decided to be bisexual. Each time, I can't help but wonder whether she really knows what she's getting into, or whether she was just so taken with the romantic story of Sailor Neptune and Sailor Uranus (or whatever other ideallic lesbian couple happens to be in vogue) that she had to try it herself.
Perhaps, though, I'm merely being a bit too curmudgeony. After all, pretty much ALL romance in pop literature is hardly a good mirror of anything in real-life. For some reason, though, fantasy homosexuality tends to bother me more.
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Actually, I have to agree with all this business. But yes, normally it's all true, except that it was an immediate box-in even worse than "another guy" taking the girl, it was a girl taking the girl, which made it virtually impossible to compete. :P But that was a special case.
I feel that, if I can't be with a girl I like because she's with another girl then it's not so bad (that male competition thing, ya know). However, if I lost a girl to another girl it might be another situation. Can't say myself, never been in that position.
But when it's two women? At the risk of generalizing again-- my favorite theory is, it's not that it's two women doing things to each other as much as it's just two women. For a straight guy, it's like, double your pleasure, double your fun. And you get to look at a second female form, which is more aesthetically pleasing than some guy's big hairy butt. And for straight women, it's just the same thing in reverse.
Yes, "double your pleasure" was exactly the phrase I was looking for! Sankyu ^^;
I, even though I do enjoy joking about it and stuff, tend to disapprove of homosexuality in anime, manga, fanfiction, etc. It's not because I'm homophobic. Actually, it's pretty near the complete opposite - I disapprove of it because I feel that it trivializes and romanticizes real-life homosexuality. Every now and then, a teenaged girl (it's almost always a girl) on one or another of the mailing lists announces that she's decided to be bisexual. Each time, I can't help but wonder whether she really knows what she's getting into, or whether she was just so taken with the romantic story of Sailor Neptune and Sailor Uranus (or whatever other ideallic lesbian couple happens to be in vogue) that she had to try it herself.
Perhaps, though, I'm merely being a bit too curmudgeony. After all, pretty much ALL romance in pop literature is hardly a good mirror of anything in real-life. For some reason, though, fantasy homosexuality tends to bother me more.
Alot of perceived homosexuality in anime and manga is not always what it seems. At least once in their life, a fan will ask "Are all Japanese women gay?" This question tends to come about because of scenes - usually in shoujo anime, although I recall some "memorable" moments from Gunbuster ^^; - where a woman will suddenly blush and get "floaty" at seeing another girl. Usually, an upperclassman who is both strong and beautiful. Although the girl in question may not neccesarily be a lesbian, she sees the other girl as an ideal partner and can envision the two in a relationship together. Doesn't necessarily mean she wants to be with her. Women look up to other women, who prove to be a strong role model. And, though Japanese are not more accepting of homosexuality than countries in the west are, there aren't all the religious taboos and conotations that exist in the west. It's not all uncommon for a young girl to develop a crush on a Takazaraku actress (Japanese all-women theater. I'm pretty sure I've misspelled it too). In fact, most families consider it healthy. As, it helps delay their daughter falling into what might be an unhealthy relationship woth a boy too early. ^^;
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It is hard for hentai to even approach romantic. Let's face it, doujinshi artists are typically going for a goal. I personally on the other hand prefer sex to be part of a larger plot, something that two people finally reach after pining for each other at a soulful level for a conciderably long amount of time. Something emotional rather than purely physical. Of course I'm just getting off topic. ;) These drawings are satisfying for the curiosity, however, especially when they're well drawn in a very similar or dead-on style.
I would have to agree. That is why I particularly enjoyed Ken Wolfe's story "Reunited." It's a side story to his "Earth" series, and furnishes us a glimpse of just how badly Ifurita and Makoto pined for one another. While I'll admit it is certainly deserving of the lemon tag, it's far from physical gratification for its own sake. Rather, it's a story of resolution and acceptance--as you can imagine Ifurita has centuries of baggage to deal with. The dialogue is heartfelt and satisfying to read, allowing the reader to feel by the time the story ends a sense of pride in their ability to deal with their issues.
And the imagery ain't bad neither. ;)
http://www.mts.net/~kenwolfe/fanfic.html
You can find the entire "Earth" series and the "Reunited" side story at the above link. Recommended reading for all EH fans, in fact, with the manga they were the primary reason I joined the fandom.
--me
Mark Engels
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And now, I must do something completely juvenile.
(http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/temp/rob/juvenile.jpg)
*snickers* *decked by Engels*
Sorry, I have nothing useful left to add. :P
I also need to read that fanfic one of these days. Maybe during one of my class breaks at school when I get my laptop back OR I print it out and haul it around.
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And now, I must do something completely juvenile.
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*snickers* *decked by Engels*
Sorry, I have nothing useful left to add. :P
And here I thought you were going to say something profound and all. How disappointing! :)
I also need to read that fanfic one of these days. Maybe during one of my class breaks at school when I get my laptop back OR I print it out and haul it around.
Yes, you do. And read all of "Earth" and "Reunited" while you're at it. I think you'll agree they're worthwhile.
[shameless_plug]
And if you REALLY feel ambitious you can give "Rough Justice" a once over.
[/shameless_plug]
--me
Mark Engels
Whose post count ought be up to 70 now.
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(http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/temp/rob/juvenile.jpg)
"If you're us, then what number are we thinking of right now?"
"69, dude!"
"Whoa!"
Ah, Keanu Reeves, in what was undoubtedly his greatest role... ;D
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One thing I've always thought was interesting is the widely-accepted love that guys have for lesbians,
Funny that...Rosh said that to me once...I think I still have that IM somewhere.... ^_^
Similiarly, somewhere between the ages of 11-13 all humans suddenly find themselves akwardly "aware" of a particular gender and curious of their own. To what amounts/extremes is up to something else.
*checks her age* Thanks Rob. *I'm 13. :'(*
Not to make this into a thing,"homosexuality is not natural and therefore punishable by death"
Thanks...again... I think the pope thinks that the above quote ' "homosexuality is not natural and therefore punishable by death" ' is totally true. *I'm not dissing anyones religion. I just don't care much for the pope at this moment in time.
Keep in mind, some women get turned on by seeing two guys for the same reason some men get turned on by seeing two women.
Well, I remember one day at school, these two guys were walking down the corridor holding hands, and I instantly thought two things: Yes! I am not alone! ^_^ and 2. Good on ya...whoever you are.
I believe there are also studies that indicate that women are generally more accepting of lesbians than men are of male gays.
Hehehe...from my experience, neither gender accepts gays or lesbians. I was dragged into a fight because I'm going out with Rosh *sorry, broke a rule*. And that's probably one of the reasons I'm only bi, and not a lesbian. Because at least, being a bi means that you still have a little freedom. Even though you do get the odd person who asks you to go out with some guy you either hate or don't know, and then a few minutes later asks you too go out with some girl you hate or don't know. :P I have experienced this far too many times, and I bet its doing me some internal damage.
I think environment and upbringing has a major impact on how tolerant a person is to gays. In ancient Greece and Rome for instance, sex between men were perfectly acceptable, and in some city states even preferred to straight sex.
Well, I've been thinking something along those lines recently. See, straight usually means, in one path or line, so therefore that would probably mean that gays and lesbians are 'straight' but 'straight' people are technically not, because that's mixing genders, and therefore, no longer a straight continuous line.
If a character IS homosexual, he or she is usually completely comfortable with it, and neither feels the need to hide it or to flaunt it. If someone is openly homosexual, his or her same-sex friends are also completely comfortable with it, as well.
*thinks of standing in the middle of a whole load on general public and then pinching rosh's bum* hehehe... ;D ::)
In real life, of course, homosexuality is nothing like that. Discovering that oneself is homosexual is usually a pretty traumatic experience.
I cried.
Every now and then, a teenaged girl (it's almost always a girl) on one or another of the mailing lists announces that she's decided to be bisexual. Each time, I can't help but wonder whether she really knows what she's getting into, or whether she was just so taken with the romantic story of Sailor Neptune and Sailor Uranus (or whatever other ideallic lesbian couple happens to be in vogue) that she had to try it herself.
Well, I truley meant it. *folds arms* I didn't just do it because of anime, or TV or anything.
I, even though I do enjoy joking about it and stuff
I do too. :-/ :-[However, if I lost a girl to another girl it might be another situation. Can't say myself, never been in that position.
*out-take from friends*
*thanks everyone in the rooms, refrains from hugging everyone, and leaves.* I think that was one of my longest ever posts. :P
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That wouldn't have been the Doctor Who episode The Two Doctors would it? Cuz that scene wasn't as pleasant as you made it out to seem. Although those two were chatting about lunch, eventually the conversation turned to cannibalism. ^^;
I was thinking I'd seen a more realistic scene just like that, in another British TV drama, or a foreign film, or somewhere. Oh well. Maybe I was mis-remembering the Who scene. It's been a few years since I saw it.
I hope the point that I was trying to make will stand without that example.
The Two Doctors is the next Colin Baker serial scheduled for DVD release, isn't it? I think I remember reading that they had enough extras to make it a 2-DVD set.
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No one ever replies to my views. :'(
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No one ever replies to my views. :'(
Maybe that just means everyone agrees with you! ;D
Oh, and I'm sorry if you took offense at my post, Lar - I wasn't trying to single you out.
As for the Pope, and religious taboos against homosexuality in general... Well, that's pretty complicated. I attended a Catholic college (I'm not Catholic, or even particularly religious, but it was near to where I lived, and had an excellent computer science program), and learned a fair bit about Christian history while I was there. It helps to know the history behind the ban on homosexuality.
Like many things that are banned, homosexuality was banned due to the way that homosexuality was misused and abused at the time. In ancient Greece, for instance (not the only time that homosexuality came under a bad light in Judeo-Christian history, but one of the most prominent), it is well-known that homosexuality was common. What not so many people know, though, is that homosexual pairings usually consisted of a man choosing a much younger boy to be his... erm... female (I could choose cruder terms ^^; ). In many cases, the younger partner would be branded as a sort of second-class citizen for the rest of his life. It was also often the case that love wasn't involved at all - these boys were chosen in much the same way that "trophy wives" are chosen today, as a symbol of status, and the more beautiful the boy, the better. Even when love WAS involved, there was a very clear distinction between who was the social superior and who was his subordinate. Basically, homosexuality was also pedophilia.
Jews at the time were disgusted with this practice, perhaps rightfully so. This was the most common form of homosexuality at the time. What would be considered "normal" homosexuality today was considered little more than flukes at the time, and was not seriously considered. And, so, like many things that were disliked by ancient peoples, homosexuality became first a social ("We say it's wrong"), then a religious ("God says it's wrong") taboo. When Christianity began, they continued the traditions begun by their Jewish predecessors.
One of the duties of the Pope is to uphold the traditions long-established by Catholicism. In some ways, this is an awesome thing - there are not many things created by mankind that can be said to have lasted more than two thousand years. It is hardly surprising that the Catholic church is slow and reluctant to change. Unfortunately, this often means that traditions get upheld that are pointless, irritating, or outright wrong, simply because they ARE, in fact, tradition.
It's easy to get angry with the traditions that you don't agree with. But if all the Catholic traditions that a significant number of people disagreed with were immediately thrown out, there wouldn't BE Catholicism. (Of course, some people would be perfectly happy with that. :P) I don't mean by this that you should be content with the Catholic stance against homosexuality, or that you shouldn't complain. You should, though, try to understand WHY this problem exists.
Basically, like most social problems, it's not simply a case of pointing at someone (in this case, the Pope) and saying, "If it wasn't for this guy, everything would be better!" It's much, much deeper and more complicated than that.
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I understand that some religions believe that it is wrong, and I don't like dissing anyones religion. But what about that minister, who was gay, who got driven from his post as the bishop of somewhere in england, because he was gay? I think that it was a bit harsh of them.
True love matters more than gender. So people fall in love, some don't. doesn't matter what gender you are, so long as you find the person you are truley happy with.
There was a film about two girls who became best friends, and they made clay models, and acted out scenes from a book they were either reading, or writing, I'm not sure which. And eventually they started acting out the love scences with each other. They were sent to phycaiatrists because everyone thought they were to close, everyone thought they were crazy.
One of the girls(i think her name was julie, she was played by Kate winslet) got ill, and had to be taken to anotehr country, but wouldn't go unless the other one came with her, so they plotted to kill one of the girls mothers and they did. They killed her with a brick in a pair of tights. They killed because they had fallen in love, and they weren't allowed to be together. They were both sent to different prisons in New Zealand, (I think) and it was a true story. It was a great film. and I admire it. But my mum taped over it.
Just think about it. Homosexuals aren't allowed to be together because of religion, because of family and friends. We're with drawn from society because we are different. I could have been beaten to a pulp because I was going out with another girl, but luckily a teacher came along. If he hadn't, then I would probably have been forced to move schools.
This is how much people hate homosexuals. I have been reasurred by people so many times, but I can't be reassured anymore. I have been through pain, not as much as some though, because of who I am.
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I was thinking I'd seen a more realistic scene just like that, in another British TV drama, or a foreign film, or somewhere. Oh well. Maybe I was mis-remembering the Who scene. It's been a few years since I saw it.
I hope the point that I was trying to make will stand without that example.
Well, the example still holds. The first time I watched that episode was with a very, very silly and incredibly stupid friend of mine. While they showed that scene of the 2nd Doc and Shockeye strolling down the Spanish countryside, arm-in-arm, my friend snickered and began saying, "CoughHOMOcough"
Even though I laughed, I was very appalled by my pal's behavior. Shock and appalled. You have to admit, though, that those two wearing the tuxedos and top-hats didn't help them out any.
The Two Doctors is the next Colin Baker serial scheduled for DVD release, isn't it? I think I remember reading that they had enough extras to make it a 2-DVD set.
Yes indeed, The Two Doctors is the next 6th Doctor episode slated for release. It looks massive! (http://www.gallifreyone.com/news.shtml#newsitemEpypEAlFlkDJljEwOx) A definate buy for me, since Two Doctors is, in my opinion, one of the best Colin Baker stories ever. All this extra crap just makes the deal even sweeter. I hope they release this thing in the US soon.
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In my view, I don't believe the old-tradition Catholic Church even exists anymore. I mean, it's changed ON A WHIM ever since.... well, it was long before Vatican 2, I can assure you. And there are so many splits and divisons... sometimes it truly makes me wonder what to believe in. But for now, I still believe in a God that's good, merciful, and wants everyone to go to Heaven and make a lot of love there. :O
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No one ever replies to my views. :'(
Sorry, Lar. I'm afraid that I don't have any advice or answers for you. But I wish you and yours the best, all the same.
That, and I'm trying to stop posting to this topic, and let it end. And doing rather badly, I might add.
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:P
It's okay... nothing more NEEDs to be said. It was about doujinshi's and it fell off. Therefore it calls for a (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/temp/rob/notey.gif) locking (http://www.el-hazardonline.net/El-Hazard/temp/rob/notey.gif)
Any new doujinshi's will now be added as regular site updates and may be discussed if chosen as necessary...
So for a final note... Dun dun dun! (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3236434267) (An-oth-er One)