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Kathy Guinea
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« Reply #15 on: May 12, 2003, 06:28:34 PM »

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All I can say is... one of us has to learn Japanese.  ;p  Or at least we wait until Sarah becomes fluent enough that we can bother her non-stop.



O_o dear God Rob! Put pressure on me why don't you? ^_^;

Unless I get that teaching job in Japan, I'm not learning much more than I already know for a while... no reason to... -_-;

Not that I dont' like it... it's just damned hard... not at all like German was (sooo easy for me). Japanese doesn't come as easily to me... and unless I'm going to USE it sometime soon... I'll just forget most of it...

Aside from translating random pages from mangas...I doubt I'll be doing much with it for a while... :p (Unless I get said job... which isn't looking too good right now...)
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mark_engels
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« Reply #16 on: May 12, 2003, 06:34:46 PM »

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Unless I get that teaching job in Japan, I'm not learning much more than I already know for a while... no reason to... -_-;

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Aside from translating random pages from mangas...I doubt I'll be doing much with it for a while... :p (Unless I get said job... which isn't looking too good right now...)


Something you might want to consider, Kathy, is a Japanese program called "home-stay."  I'm told by friend and fellow EH fictwriter Ken Wolfe it's not unlike being an exchange student or hosting one in your home.  From what he tells me there are a number of Japanese households that open their doors to visiting "gaijin" for two weeks up to one year stays.  

And some are "full immersion"--the host families don't speak a word of English.  I suppose it would be the ultimate in crash course Nihongo...

Anyone interested in more information, use this forum's IM feature to send me your email address.  I'll forward your requests on to Ken so he can reply to you directly.

--me

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« Reply #17 on: May 16, 2003, 08:08:30 PM »

Japanese can be rather confusing for someone learning it. Especially with things like the three different ways you can count objects. No, not everything is ichi, nii, san, shi! Then there is all the humbling politeness you're supposed to pepper your speech with. It all can seem confusing and even a bit humiliating at times.

On the other hand, I am promising myself to pick up a copy of "Japanese for busy people" from the library one of these days (maybe during my week off) just because I never seem to get around to making an effort to improve my Japanese!

And I hate to sound like a sub recruiter, but you dub people could stand to watch a little more subtitled anime! It will improve your basic understanding of japanese at the least! ^_^;
« Last Edit: May 16, 2003, 08:10:35 PM by saucer » Logged


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« Reply #18 on: May 16, 2003, 08:25:04 PM »

Improve my knowledge of the language?

Try looking at the Saturn game.  Loads of Japanese, no translation.  We picked up a few words... ogi-san (if that is the correct phonetic spelling) is princess and jingi (also, if that is correct phonetic spelling) is "holy object".

Look, I may not know Japanese in my life time, but I pick it up here and there.  I don't pick up words very well via subtitles (unless it is given in one word statements, like said "Jingi").

But, yet again, what do I know?  It took me three years to learn English.
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Captain Southbird (EHOL Creator)
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« Reply #19 on: May 16, 2003, 09:11:17 PM »

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And I hate to sound like a sub recruiter, but you dub people could stand to watch a little more subtitled anime! It will improve your basic understanding of japanese at the least! ^_^;


Sorry, S.  I will learn Japanese only if I see it truly fit.  And I've watched plenty of subtitled anime, whole series even, although they're mostly the unreleased fansubs my sister downloads.  All I have to say is, read the document linked in my sig.  Dubs have reached a modern status of A-OK.  I even emailed the guy a personal thanks and saved the reply.  :P  

A bit from the reply (this is all from the guy, I didn't keep any of my part in this segment):

Quote
The dub is better than the Japanese, on the whole. Some characters are voiced better in Japanese, but many characters are far more entertaining in English. Mr. Fujisawa and Jinnai will go down as two of the greatest anime voices of all time.

...

Thou speakest blasphemy, dub-lover! :-) :-) :-)
How can you even consider that the dub could *improve* upon the script! But, yeah, that's what *made* the El-Hazard dub. (And the You're Under Arrest dub for that matter...)



And also, be fair.  I don't think anyone on this board is as neurotic about this as me (maybe Neil).  Many others here are frequent subtitle viewers.  And I'm only pledging allegiance to the El-Hazard dub (although I remember others like the Trigun dub being at least "good".)  Remember that I'm highly subjective.  I like things on a title basis.  I don't see myself as an "anime" fan... I'm an El-Hazard fan.  It's not my fault that happens to be "anime".  :P  (Granted, very few US cartoons come to par with "anime", but that's life.)  

Japanese culture on a whole doesn't strike me as terribly interesting other than in an academic sense.  My sister was once on a stint of practicing false humility to every compliment I gave her until I said "Shut up and take the compliment!"  Frankly from an engineering point of view, I see it as a highly inefficent language.  
The roman alphabet consists of only 26 characters of which every sound required can be made by combining the characters in different patterns.  I liken this to a lookup table in one of my programs that produces tight, efficent, small-sized code.  

Japanese has thousands of characters.  I liken this to software written with a ton of raw spaghetti logic that produces huge, clunky, hard-to-debug code.  And, for that matter, incredibly hard to go back to a few months later.

Now that's my opinion, and keep in mind only my opinion.  There are others on this board much less neurotic than me.  I can't change you, you can't change me.  :P

The only time I'd concider it worthwhile to learn Japanese is if I were to flee this country... and with the war monger government we've been having lately, quite frankly Japan sounds like a paradise.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2003, 09:14:47 PM by rob_jinnai » Logged

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« Reply #20 on: May 16, 2003, 09:24:41 PM »

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Try looking at the Saturn game.  Loads of Japanese, no translation.  We picked up a few words... ogi-san (if that is the correct phonetic spelling) is princess and jingi (also, if that is correct phonetic spelling) is "holy object".

Actually, ogi-san is Uncle or old man. Ogii-san is grandfather. Perhaps you're thinking of Ougi, which means Prince? Hime means princess. Sometimes Ojou is also used, which basically means little girl. But when used honorably it can also mean Princess, Queen or Lady.

Easy Rob ol' pal, I'm just offering a suggestion. You guys were talking about needing somebody to pump for information about japanese right?

::hears the You're Under Arrest dub mentioned and enters grand mal seizures::
« Last Edit: May 16, 2003, 09:27:03 PM by saucer » Logged


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« Reply #21 on: May 16, 2003, 09:32:36 PM »

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Easy Rob ol' pal, I'm just offering a suggestion. You guys were talking about needing somebody to pump for information about japanese right?


I just know I want someone who can read the mysterious pages of the artbooks / OSTs, and tell me the gist of what goes on in the dramas.  ;)  And not what we can guess goes on in the dramas, because I think we've all done that a few thousand times, but I do mean someone who can really understand at least most of the words being spoken and even write a transcript if (s)he was so inclined.  :P

And I host the results on the website with a little line reading credit to your name.  


Actually, what IS nice about El-Hazard, there's not a lot of need to fully get Japanese custom, because for the most part its based in another [fictional] society, not Japan.  The most you really have to know about Japan is that the boys and girls are wearing those uniforms.
« Last Edit: May 16, 2003, 09:34:07 PM by rob_jinnai » Logged

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« Reply #22 on: May 16, 2003, 09:33:00 PM »

Well, I tried.

Sue me, I have a hard time understanding a language that didn't include a manual with, okay?

If I had actually taken a course in Japanese (or if my little brother Joseph hadn't hidden the "Learn basic Japanese" book and tape on me), I would recognize the words better.

See, I have been taking a course on Spanish this year, and now I understand some of the properties of the language.

Ustedes leen unos lengues libros, mmkay?
« Last Edit: May 16, 2003, 09:35:47 PM by thegameguy » Logged

I do not know who to blame more...

My crapola mouse that needs to double click on everything... except when I need it to...

Or the new and more "convenient" version of PowerDVD (which will NOT let you take a darn picture fo
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« Reply #23 on: May 16, 2003, 09:36:07 PM »

Oh, and don't worry.  I never get angry or anything about this.  I'm just keeping dub support up for my own sake.  ;)  Actually disagreements are what make good use of forums.  If everyone posted something and it was all followed by "Yes, sir.", then where we would be, hmm?
« Last Edit: May 16, 2003, 09:37:00 PM by rob_jinnai » Logged

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Kathy Guinea
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« Reply #24 on: May 17, 2003, 12:00:01 AM »

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On the other hand, I am promising myself to pick up a copy of "Japanese for busy people" from the library one of these days (maybe during my week off) just because I never seem to get around to making an effort to improve my Japanese!


Heh I have that book... is ok... they spend a lot of time on counting in the first few chapters... which is frustrating, complicated and uninteresting (and I don't mean basic counting I mean all the counters like mai (for flat things), hon (for stick things), ko (for round things), nin (for people), fun (for counting minutes) etc.) ... :p I KNOW it's essential but they should have waited to do that a little later in the book IMHO. I got to maybe the 8th chapter... we were using it in my non-credit Japanese class that I took. I probably should get back into it... but I don't see any point in pushing myself unless I AM getting that job overseas... 9_9 Right now I'm content in "translating" random pages of manga (as best I can which isn't too good-- but I get the idea)...


Quote
If I had actually taken a course in Japanese (or if my little brother Joseph hadn't hidden the "Learn basic Japanese" book and tape on me), I would recognize the words better.


Heh actually Tim... MOM gave that to ME to use ^_^; It's somewhat helpful as a companion to the "Japanese for Busy People" book eventhough it's not by the same company or part of the same course... I need to get back into that too... but like I said... not unless I AM going away... I'll just forget it if I don't use it... 9_9

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« Reply #25 on: May 22, 2003, 12:09:24 AM »

Japanese... I don't have any actual courses, buuuutt...

I have a "Japanese for Dummies" book. Interesting to say the least.

also, www.mooglemb.com has a "Japanese Lessons" forum which will help get you in the know. There are also quite a few people on that forum who are pretty dang fluent.
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« Reply #26 on: May 22, 2003, 01:20:27 AM »

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Heh I have that book... is ok... they spend a lot of time on counting in the first few chapters... which is frustrating, complicated and uninteresting (and I don't mean basic counting I mean all the counters like mai (for flat things), hon (for stick things), ko (for round things), nin (for people), fun (for counting minutes) etc.) ... :p I KNOW it's essential but they should have waited to do that a little later in the book IMHO. I got to maybe the 8th chapter... we were using it in my non-credit Japanese class that I took. I probably should get back into it... but I don't see any point in pushing myself unless I AM getting that job overseas... 9_9 Right now I'm content in "translating" random pages of manga (as best I can which isn't too good-- but I get the idea)...

There are also audio and video versions of "Japanese For Busy People" as well. I'm thinking more along those lines, easier for me than trying to look at a book. I look through some of those books on learning Japanese and go @_@
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